Current state of Advanced Ballistic on AWE (31.7.2017)

[kman]

Following talk about ACE Advanced Ballistics training and Ryko's post here:

I set on to find what it all means and how it works, because my previous attempts to play Marksman on AWE gave VERY chaotic experience.
Now I know why.

 
Advanced Ballistic test on AWE 31.7., COx Gauntlet Altis

test is aimed on how does Advanced Ballistics work with selected High-Powered scopes

 

First set of tests done on non-Marksman position (spawned as Rifleman)

Weapon: MK 18 Mod1, ammo: 5.56mm Mk262

 

1) Trijicon ACOG TA648RMR (marksman scope with 6x magnification but no dialing - only fixed reticle)
RESULT: scope is hitting according to reticle and with quite OP magnification for non-marksman

 

2) SUSAT L9A1 (primarily Autorifle/LMG scope with 4x magnification and VANILA dialing: 100m,200m..up to 600m)
RESULT: scope is hitting according to simplified vanila Arma dialing

 

3) TA31RCO (magnification is not listed, but feels like 3x to me, yet scope has MIL dialing)
RESULT: scope is hitting according to ADVANCED BALLISTICS - target 434m away is not hit on 4.3 MIL (like it would be on vanila) but rather 3.4 MIL as suggested by ATragMX after proper input

Second set of tests done in Marksman slot
Weapon: MK 11 Mod 0, ammo: 7.62mm M993
 

1) Trijicon ACOG TA648RMR (marksman scope with 6x magnification but no dialing - only fixed reticle)
RESULT: scope is visibly over-shooting when using Reticle. Since it's fixed reticle, it is likely because it's not made for 7.62mm calliber.

 

2) SUSAT L9A1 (primarily Autorifle/LMG scope with 4x magnification and VANILA dialing: 100m,200m..up to 600m)
RESULT: scope is hitting according to simplified vanila Arma dialing

 

3) TA31RCO (magnification is not listed, but feels like 3x to me, scope has MIL DIALING!)
RESULT: scope is significantly over-shooting when dialed to "7" (vanila value for 700m)

When dialing 5.7 MIL value offered by ATragMX, it is only slightly over-shooting, it is possible I do not have proper Gun&Ammo values (I'm suspecting Ballistic Coefficient)

 

3) AMS (3x-10x magnification sniper scope has MIL DIALING)
RESULT: same as TA31RCO - slight over-shooting when using ATragMX value

 

4) Leupold Mark 4 ER/T (max magnification not listed, but seems the same as LRPS - 25x, scope has VANILA dialing 100m,200m..up to 1000m)
RESULT: scope is hitting according to simplified vanila Arma dialing - I call this "cheater sniper scope of the year"

 

5) LRPS (max 25x magnification scope with MIL dialing)
RESULT: Just like TA31RCO and AMS, scope is affected by Advanced Ballistics and uses ATragMX values

 

 

TEST RESULTS:
Advanced Ballistics on AWE are governed by scopes used - MIL Dialing scope will enable them, even for NON-marksman position (currently only for TA31RCO)
other scopes are not affected even if they are high-powered (SUSAT and particulary Leupold)

 

Side notes:
1) Range Card is not pulling Gun & Ammo values when gun is equiped and loaded, making creating new Gun&Ammo combination in ATragMX impossible in-game
This is definitely due to "Advanced Ballistics: Disabled" server setting - tested in Editor that they appear when this is "Enabled"

 

2) When MIL dialing scope is equiped, ACE Self-Interaction > Equipment is not offering "Set Zero Adjustment" option to correctly ZERO scope.
This is also due to "Advanced Ballistics: Disabled" - verified in Editor.

 

3) Bullet Spin Drift seems completely turned off, even ATragMX is not showing any Windage values, despite Rifle Twist value entered in gun parameters (there should always be some Spin Drift, especially for longer ranges).
I'm again suspecting "Advanced Ballistics: Disabled"

Conclusion:

Currently (31.7.2017) according to Ryko's information, we have these Advanced Ballistic settings on AWE:
Advanced Ballistics: Disabled
Enabled for Snipers: Enabled
Enabled For Group Members: Disabled
Enabled for Everyone: Disabled
Disabled In FullAuto Mode: Disabled
Enable Ammo Temperature Simulation: Disabled
Enable Barrel Length Simulation: Disabled
Enable Bullet Trace Effect: Disabled
Sim Interval: 0.0
Sim Radius: 3000

 

 

This is actually not working like I thought it was. I will enumerate:

 

1) "Advanced Ballistics"
Having this disabled (in conjunction with second setting) is NOT making AB exclusive to Marksmen, it is OVERALL module setting and actually prevents AB from functioning properly:
* range card don't populate with Gun&Ammo data
* MIL scopes can't be properly zeroed (default zeroing is always slightly off - confirmed in Editor)
* likely cause of non-existent bullet spin drift and maybe other minor variables as well

 

2) "Enabled for Snipers"
When enabled, this makes AB work, when any player shoots through MIL dialing scope, regardless of their slot or gun.
(although AB is in crippled state if first setting is disabled)

 

3) "Enabled For Group Members"
I have not been able to find what this actually means, but in editor I letf it disabled and AB was working fine for Marksman/Sniper purposes.

 

3) "Enabled for Everyone"
According to some sources I red, this is the setting that would cause Server FPS problems when enabled. However testing in Editor, I can confirm this will STILL NOT affect NON-Dialing scopes and Vanila-style "Step-scopes" 100m, 200m, 300m....

 

4) "Disabled In FullAuto Mode"
When enabled, this prevents FullAuto weapons like Autorifles and LMGs equiped with MIL-dialing scopes from being affected by AB (verified in Editor).
If we want AB enabled, this should be ENABLED TOO, to prevent lag should some Autorifleman find himself MIL scope and start spraying.

 

5) "Enable Ammo Temperature Simulation" - additionaly populates Range Card with information, how does temperature of Ammo before shooting (e.g. ambient temperature) affects Muzzle Velocity due to influence of temperature on powder-burn speed, when bullet is fired. "Cold" gunpowder burns slower and lowers Muzzle Velocity.

6) "Enable Barrel Length Simulation" - complicates entering Gun data into ATragMX if you use silencer, since it will affect Ballistic Coefficient of the gun.

7) "Enable Bullet Trace Effect" - when shooting high-calliber bullets with high-powered scope, you will actually see Mirage caused by your bullet cutting through air. Pretty.

 

 

Suggestions for changes:

 

Following my testing, I would like to suggest following changes to AWE Advanced Ballistic settings and Scopes:

 

1) settings:
Advanced Ballistics: Enabled
Enabled for Snipers: Enabled
Disabled In FullAuto Mode: Enabled

All other settings to remain disabled and current Sim Interval & Radius values kept.

 

2) Scopes
* Blacklist "Leupold" scopes for everyone, they bypass any AB settings and allow simplistic vanila targeting on extreme ranges (25x magnification).
* Blacklist "Trijicon ACOG" scopes, they offer very hight 6x magnification and bypass any AB settings
* I'm not sure about "SUSAT L9A1", it cheats the system like Leupold/Trijicon, but only have 4x zoom, ranges to 600m and is intended for LMG, that is perhaps reasonable. Maybe whitelist it only to Autorifleman and FSG?

* I would also remove "TA31RCO", not because it's OP, but because it sucks. 3x magnification and requirement to use AB dialing to make it work.

It's basically punishment, to issue this to troops.

 

I would like to know, how does community feels about this.
I'll be glad to share all things I learned during testing about Advanced Ballistis on training session, should we choose to make AB work properly.

 

[Ryko]

Excellent investigative work kman. We will be discussing internally! 

[Guest]

So @kman, I feel like that is a lot of text and that I am a very lazy person. This means that I hate you. But you really need to find something better to spend your free time on

[ShadowAce11]

Like given for the insane amount of effort that went into this. Despite playing roughly 860 hours of Arma 3 exclusively on EU3 since I first logged on in May 2016, I have never taken the slot as I have feared the differing zeroing methods (plus I'm less of a rifle guy and more of a driving-a-nuke-with-an-American-flag-bumper-sticker kind of guy anyhow, demonstration in spoiler below) and whether or not they're even utilized. This guide may convince me to finally take it. 

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Karate Pyjamas]

8 hours ago, kman said:

Following talk about ACE Advanced Ballistics training and Ryko's post here:

* I would also remove "TA31RCO", not because it's OP, but because it sucks. 3x magnification and requirement to use AB dialing to make it work.

It's basically punishment, to issue this to troops.

 

I would like to know, how does community feels about this.
I'll be glad to share all things I learned during testing about Advanced Ballistis on training session, should we choose to make AB work properly.

 

4

Touch my trijicon and you will die. It's very simple. Range it to 1.1 and you will be hitting right on target. Don't range it any higher as you have quite accurate mildots for that. Besides, any further and you're not even supposed to be effective beyond that. IT's a really good realism scope, besides all other Trijicons suck because they don't have 3D scopes/options.

[kennychr]

All rhs scopes have a 3d option, press esc ingame -> rhs options and change optivs style to 3d. Then you will get all the rhs acogs etc. in 3d (the ones that support it)

[Miczils]

It's beautiful, simply beautiful.

 

Sent from my SM-G935F using a phone app that is really irritating because it constantly advertises itself.

 

 

[kman]

8 hours ago, Karate Pyjamas said:

Touch my trijicon and you will die. It's very simple. Range it to 1.1 and you will be hitting right on target. Don't range it any higher as you have quite accurate mildots for that. Besides, any further and you're not even supposed to be effective beyond that. IT's a really good realism scope, besides all other Trijicons suck because they don't have 3D scopes/options.

Karate loves the runt of the litter. awwwww

 

7 hours ago, kennychr said:

All rhs scopes have a 3d option, press esc ingame -> rhs options and change optivs style to 3d. Then you will get all the rhs acogs etc. in 3d (the ones that support it)

 

OMG.. always new things to learn.. thank you.

[kman]

14 hours ago, Ryko said:

Excellent investigative work kman. We will be discussing internally! 

 

/salute

 

One more thing about the slight overshooting that happened to me during longer distance shots on AWE (but not in Editor):

 

Does AWE also use module "ace_weather"? It is also prequisite for Advanced Ballistics module.

For all my tests on both AWE and Editor I was entering weather data from Kestrel (Temperature / Baro pressure / Humidity).

 

In editor I had "ace_weather" module placed on map too, but can't verify if it's on AWE.

[EDIT]: and all its settings set to "enabled"

[Ryko]

14 minutes ago, kman said:

In editor I had "ace_weather" module placed on map too, but can't verify if it's on AWE.

 

Yes, Gauntlet uses the ace_weather module, everything is enabled with an update interval of 600.