Stiletto Feedback Thread

[Stanhope]

Bug:
Version _004 Lythium:

Grenadier has access to the vanilla 3rnd 40mm HE and smoke grenades.  

[Johnson]

I heard reports that the plane spawn spawns planes 20m in the air? Not too sure haven't tested this myself.

[Borrel]

What about a dedicated EOD squad?

remove the eod from the normal squads. Give them engineers.

 

squad can consist of:

1 eod officer (squad leader)

1 engineer / eod corporal

2 rifleman for protection

 

they could have there own vehicle or get taken with them in a helicopter when there are ieds found in the area

 

infantry squads/engineer can mark the ied and continue on mission. Eod will clear them.

 

would be just like the real world. (Dont know about the rifleman but its like with the eod guys)

[Fraggloid]

From my limited time on Stiletto, it seems pretty good. My only comments would be that things seem somewhat slow and bland at times, though that may be due to the roles I've played/the specific AOs I've been involved in.

[Ryko]

Version 007 is on the server now and set to default.

 

Lots of noteworthy changes: most of this is documented in the Map screen under "Stiletto".

1. You can now view the last known threat level for each civilian area on your map, there is a toggle button marked "Show/Hide Civilian Areas". If it's grey diagonal lines, there's no intel in that area. As intel is reviewed, the map is updated. To prevent clutter, these areas can be toggled on and off with the same button.

2. Revised much of the content to allow for non-insurgency themed missions. If a conventional army is chosen as the opfor faction, they will not employ guerilla tactics such as IEDs and booby-traps on soldiers' bodies. Civilians, however, are a different matter. If they don't like you, they may booby-trap their vehicles, and IEDs may be present in civilian areas. A mission parameter is available to disable guerilla tactics if the Insurgent factions are chosen.

3. UAV soldier now has access to the Darter. Don't make me regret this. Also the arsenal was tweaked as I think many classes had access to sniper weapons. Also 3-round 40mm grenades have been removed.

4. Chance of suicide bombers spawning in areas which are hostile towards players. As well, enemy troops may garrison in these areas.

5. Fixed endgame / final mission spawning: last mission should hopefully spawn if the mission threshold is met or exceeded (takes into account situations where multiple missions spawn between interval checks).

6. New locations system, including a notifier on the bottom left of the screen that tells you if you are entering or leaving an area.

7. Several civilian vehicles now roam the country side, including a helicopter which runs between the north and south airports.

8. Planes in the southern airfield should now spawn properly.

9. Enemy combatants that are captured (restrained) and then executed will impart the same karma penalty to the area as if the enemy were a civilian (ie., don't do it).

 

Re specific comments:

- Dedicated EOD squad - not a bad idea but that'd really be more useful on larger player counts. Otherwise what will tend to happen is stuff will get overlooked if it's not dealt with immediately by the players. Keep in mind that the Platoon Commander can create custom squads, so if this is appealing, it can be done in the current system (just create a new 3-man squad with a SL, EOD tech and rifleman).

- The banana ... no.

[SiegeSix]

On 10/8/2017 at 9:26 PM, Borrel said:

What about a dedicated EOD squad?

remove the eod from the normal squads. Give them engineers.

 

squad can consist of:

1 eod officer (squad leader)

1 engineer / eod corporal

2 rifleman for protection

 

they could have there own vehicle or get taken with them in a helicopter when there are ieds found in the area

 

infantry squads/engineer can mark the ied and continue on mission. Eod will clear them.

 

would be just like the real world. (Dont know about the rifleman but its like with the eod guys)

@Ryko

Can't this be implemented towards Nomad and Blackjack? Make a Specialist an EOD Spec and Assistant the bodyguard?

 

To put my suggestion on the table:
Squad Leader Section should instead consist of:

- Squad Leader

- Radio Operator (same use as FAC, but instead of having SL on two radios with a leadership role, he can do the leading and have another guy do the LR chatting. This would be a pro for stressful moments and where the two radios interfere.)

- Designated Marksman

- Rifleman (Or so called "Designated Scout" or SL's right hand guy)

[Ryko]

Let me say this another way. 

 

The default squads are just that, default. 

 

If you want to make a custom squad, go PlatCo and do it

[LEO]

what dues the new color codes on the towns on stelleto mean?  (sony pointed it our for me)

 also i think that intel is too few and far betwen (in this version).

 and there are to meny armed enemies at the start of the game, like a regular foot patrole becomes a combat partrole insted

( there migth be some discrepancies in this findings due to unknown civilan catualties)

 

also a shift in mindset for squad leaders and infatery alike is necessary in my opinion

 

edit there are way to meny areas on the map that are in red/ black collor witch might explane the hevy enemy presence in moste of the missions

 

edit 2  is there a reason that the new squad creation system requies 3 caracters for the call sign? also the eod spsialist can not be selected in the squad creation menu. also call sing for the costume group is not working properly the call sign i used was EOD and it appeard as CST

[Einarsen]

2 hours ago, LEO said:

what dues the new color codes on the towns on stelleto mean?

 also i think that intel is too few and far betwen (in this version).

 and there are to meny armed enemies at the start of the game, like a regular foot patrole becomes a combat partrole insted

( there migth be some discrepancies in this findings due to unknown civilan catualties)

 

also a shift in mindset for squad leaders and infatery alike is necessary in my opinion

Color codes etc. are explained in the side menu on the map

[Ryko]

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 also i think that intel is too few and far betwen (in this version).

 

Pretty much everything is random: the karma status in each town, and whether or not enemies and civilians carry intel items. As well, it's a random chance whether you find intel when you search an object (car/body/cache etc) so it might be there, you just didn't find it. I may increase these percentages if it's feeling like people are never finding intel.

 

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there are way to meny areas on the map that are in red/ black collor witch might explane the hevy enemy presence in moste of the missions

 

It's random, but also keep in mind that entities are spawned when you enter the area, so for the sake of performance these are just indicators that indicate what kind of contact you're likely to face in those areas. But yes, red/black areas are likely to contain enemy patrols and garrisons (and removing those enemies will likely improve the karma rating there).

 

People were mentioning that there wasn't as much action - shouldn't be the case now. If you want to get into trouble, just aim for the red and black areas.

 

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 is there a reason that the new squad creation system requies 3 caracters for the call sign? also the eod spsialist can not be selected in the squad creation menu. also call sing for the costume group is not working properly the call sign i used was EOD and it appeard as CST

 

I wanted it to be something that shows up fairly easily. EOD was added fairly late in the game so I'll just need to add that role to the master list. If it's appearing as CST in the list of squads that just means it's a custom squad (as opposed to INF / SPT / CMD / ARM / AIR) but if it's showing up on CTAB as CST then that's a bug.

[Guest Bartlett]

On 04/08/2017 at 6:18 PM, Ryko said:

Taken from this page:

 

http://www.americanspecialops.com/marsoc/

 

So you can figure out how the Navy and the Marines work together, or don't. Either way - he's a medic.

 

It's not meant to be taken as gospel, though. In Arma there's no need for an "operations sergeant" and an "assistant operations sergeant". In the real world we have to worry about food and water and stuff.

Add the banana back to the inventory:,)

[Guest Bartlett]

I want  to report a bug. The last time I was on with ryko we completed stiletto then you disconnected and stiletto started again there was me Leo border and h2k and I think cellhawk sorry if I forgot anyone.... We did cache November up north near the airfield then people started to leave a mission labelled rescue rook spawned off map in the bottom left.... me and another player used a heli to check for any signs of it but with no luck just thought I'd let you know 

[Borrel]

So what about the insurgents.. is stiletto on all maps? Or only in the afghanistan like map? If so, do we have taliban fighters on the server? Cos I never saw a taliban insurgent walking in hawai shirts ?

 

Im really new to this server so maybe its something i dont know yet?

[LEO]

Just now, Borrel said:

So what about the insurgents.. is stiletto on all maps? Or only in the afghanistan like map? If so, do we have taliban fighters on the server? Cos I never saw a taliban insurgent walking in hawai shirts ?

 

Im really new to this server so maybe its something i dont know yet?

we removed most of the opfor uniforms during the last major update on eu 3. so that might be why you see sutch non fiting out fits on some of the opfor

[Lindi]

I'm quite liking it so far! I like the civies being all around makes the world seem so much more alive.

 

[Guest EnragedTeddyBear]

played some yesturday and i really like it gives more peeps more to do  really like it  

[Einarsen]

Loving this new mode, wish it was on more! I've had some issues so far with civilians not offering any responses other than <null> whatever the friendliness of the town, also lots of contacts spawning in and around friendly areas and a lot less in hostile areas? Also, searching a person/vehicle multiple times might bring different results?

 

I'd like to see more focus on the Karma-feature. I feel like there's a divide in the player base, some players want to do the main missions and get some action while others might want to have more focus in the humanitarian side. Suggestions for possible features to improve this:

• Positive karma in towns for clearing IEDs. (General positive karma in the region for clearing IEDs both in towns and outside?)
• Bring in the convoy missions from the regular game mode as a way to improve karma, but as an optional side mission you can choose to do.
  This could be some trucks parked at the FOB, which when interacted with would create a mission for a random town.
  If the mission is succeeded, you could be free to bring the truck back and resupply it. If you lose it, that's it. 
  Could be different kinds, f.ex. bringing food/water/medical supplies to one town would make a major karma-boost in that town and bring with it possibilities for intel.
• Make a patrol-kind of mission, also optionable. You're tasked to patrol one or more random towns.
  Whatever the karma-state of the town, positive karma is given when units are present for a set amount of time.
  If it's a friendly town it's a great opportunity to gather intel and if it's a hostile one it's a great opportunity to bring positive karma from cleaning it out.
• Medical mission. A random town has been attacked or is suffering from <insert random medical issues>, you're tasked with heading over, setting OW and have random civilians gather around the town center in need of medical assistance. Improves karma.

This would also make it more optional if players want to increase the time it takes before the server ends as you have the possibility to do more missions than just the regular ones which have a set amount?

 

Also, it would be nice to have something to do with POWs/detainees. Sometimes you end up detaining civilians/soldiers for legit reasons, but have nothing to do with them, except leave them be or just stash them somewhere.

[Ryko]

@Einarsen I do like the ideas you've got going here, they are definitely in the long term plan but not easy to implement in the first versions.

 

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I've had some issues so far with civilians not offering any responses other than <null> whatever the friendliness of the town

 

Yeah, a bug I'll be looking into

 

Quote

also lots of contacts spawning in and around friendly areas and a lot less in hostile areas

 

There is some randomization involved in this, technically enemy contacts shouldn't be spawning in areas that are defined as friendly, but it could also be a couple of other circumstances:

1) The area is shown on the map as friendly, but karma has been degraded due to player actions, and the map hasn't been updated - it only gets updated when a review intel action is taken, and even then, it's not guaranteed that the area's threat level will be updated properly, reflecting the fog of war and problem of accurate information being relayed to high command

2) what you're perceiving as contacts spawning in the area could be mission-related contacts, or ambient AI

 

There is some level of randomness in this as well, so even if a town is threat level black, it might only have 1 or 2 enemy squads, while a neutral town might have as many as four squads.

 

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Also, searching a person/vehicle multiple times might bring different results

 

Yes, because it's a random chance that you'll find intel items or traps: different roles are better at doing things than others.  The EOD specialist has an extremely high chance of detecting and defusing traps, while the Squad leader is the best at locating intel items.  If it was an automatic success for either of these functions then there would be no need for an EOD when any role is as good as the other at these tasks.  At present the worst skill is 50%, so half of the time searching will produce a result.

 

The original version of this mission had an attached CIA operative with each team who was the best at locating intel, and I also had a Translator who was an attached resistance soldier who had a higher chance of cooperation from the local civilians; I may re-introduce these specialized roles at some point.

 

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Positive karma in towns for clearing IEDs.

 

In theory I like this idea, but there is at present no event handler that can be attached to IED defusal, so detecting and rewarding that event will require another method such as a constant loop that counts the number of IEDs in an area compared with how many were spawned. To be honest though I'm not sure the civilian population would really be aware on an immediate basis that IEDs have been removed - in a real world setting they might appreciate those actions months later, not hours.

 

In the future town populations may also spawn with some static events that would allow for karma rewards, like wounded civilians or civilians with certain needs (ie., if he asks for a certain item and you give it to him, you improve the town's karma).

 

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Bring in the convoy missions from the regular game mode as a way to improve karma, but as an optional side mission you can choose to do.

 

I do also like this idea, but I just need to adapt the mission interface to allow for it. Just running the convoy mission means a potential case where there are three missions running and the player launches a fourth, which would stretch the limits of performance (Gauntlet runs one mission at a time, while Stiletto can run up to 3 right now).

 

Also, there would need to be other factors determined. Where do the players need to bring the supplies to? Do they need to deliver them to a particular civilian, like a village elder? Is there a hard limit on how many "civilian aid boxes" or whatever, that the players have access to?

 

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Make a patrol-kind of mission, also optionable. You're tasked to patrol one or more random towns.

 

What I like about the current implementation of Stiletto - and what players are going to have to wrap their heads around - is that this already exists, but not in the conventional sense. What you're looking for is a task that pops up and says "Go patrol in this town and find intel", but all the components for this are already there, just without the official "task". If you see a town that's threat level red and decide to go there, you know you're going to find some enemies, who will probably have some intel on them, and removing the enemy threat will improve the town's karma level (perhaps even to the point that civilians are willing to talk to you).  Conversely, going to a green threat level town will find lots of friendly civilians who will likely talk to you and give you intel items. Players have a lot more freedom to organize their actions towards specific goals than they ever did in Gauntlet.

 

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Whatever the karma-state of the town, positive karma is given when units are present for a set amount of time.

 

Requires a loop which I'm not into, also means the players will just sit around doing nothing which doesn't augment the enjoyment factor.

 

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...if players want to increase the time it takes before the server ends as you have the possibility to do more missions than just the regular ones which have a set amount?

 

I think you'll come up against that initial divide of players, the ones who want more of a Life Server experience versus those who want to engage and complete specific objectives.

 

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Also, it would be nice to have something to do with POWs/detainees. Sometimes you end up detaining civilians/soldiers for legit reasons, but have nothing to do with them, except leave them be or just stash them somewhere.

 

Well that's the thing, isn't it? A special forces team isn't really equipped to deal with a bunch of detained insurgents or civilians, which leads to interesting situations. I agree that there should be an option to return a captured insurgent to base for interrogation and the possibility of more intel.

 

Right now if you try to take a civilian out of his location he will despawn once the last player leaves the area.  Arguably, unless the civilian has become an insurgent, there really isn't a good reason to keep them detained.

 

Ultimately I'd like to create a more fleshed-out system for interacting with civilians, but I suspect that will become very cumbersome within the current interface.

[Guest Bartlett]

3 hours ago, Ryko said:

The original version of this mission had an attached CIA operative with each team who was the best at locating intel, and I also had a Translator who was an attached resistance soldier who had a higher chance of cooperation from the local civilians; I may re-introduce these specialized roles at some point.

I really like this idea on putting different roles into squads. I have been thinking over the past few days about the realism that's brought into this. Now as most people know I'm usually the medic. But on research on the British army (speaking with good friends who are enlisted) They have a medic as part of their group but as we know if it's major it's a case of casevac. Now there tends to  be quite a few  players now that want to be medic and pilot. my thought is to replace the squad medics and have them run as casevac providing they have enough pilots. As anyone really can take a few more bandages and tourniquets (probably spelt wrong) and stabilise the casualty which is all the combat medic is really there to do whilst they fall back and call in casevac..... either that or somehow lower the squad medics ability by not allowing him to give fluids and paks/stitches making casevac as important as it is IRL. Thus preventing the availability of cas which I have seen quite a lot as the pilots are limited to what different roles to play being either transport or cas..... And also can the casevac heli be added to the spawn post as all that's there is armed via the big beast

 

 

So in a nutshell I'm basically saying by lowering the skill level of the squad medic your effectively turning them into a rifleman with extra bandages and tourniquets. That frees up the 'rifleman' To become the CIA/Translator, 

 

I mainly say this as it's nice to have cas but if we're playing stiletto which I believe is more simulated to realism then cas isn't always there. There's no shame in falling back to REHASH and devise a counter offensive which is just as effective as cas +  when the TL has the ability to call in supports then cas isnt really needed also..... 

[Borrel]

Sorry about not quoting, im on my freakin phone and its pretty hard to just quote some of a message on the small screen

 

 

About the fact if civilians notice if an IED is gone and if they like it or not?

It depends on the civilian. Afghan civis are different as I hope we should all know by now. Some of them hate that there are NATO forces in there country, and some absolutely love us, or somewhere between that.

 

In real life, when you render save an IED in a town, a lot of civis are thankfull of that, some of them are not but they are related to the taliban, and you should watch out for them. It could be because they are afraid for the taliban because they will probably murder them and there family because the covo is helping NATO forces or the civis get paid by taliban (more then nato does).

 

doesnt matter what reasons there are. But civis will notice it almost directly if you render safe an ied. Why? If I am living in a small town, i immediatly know when there are foreign troops coming into my neighboorhood. Just as i know when taliban is planting an ied in fromt of my uncles house. So when EOD is doing his things, i will look out of my window made of camel shit to see what they are doing. Well, i think you get the point by now.

so it will definitly not take months for me to notice if they are gone or not. Only thing to take into account is: will inbe happy or not, am i friendly to nato or to taliban, or do i just want to live my life, protect my family and hate taliban and nato together. Many factors that play a role there.

 

now i know, all those human factors are nice in real life, but not in a game. (Or maybe there is somekind of random

option to put on civis related to karma)

 

 

 

then, medical supplys and other humanitairian stuff.

maybe? When the new dlc is out (not sure if everyone has to buy it then) yoi can have random missions where there is a red cross organisation present in a town (maybe after you had a mission there and fucked up the whole town).

that organisation has put up a small point with some tent to give out food and medical supplys.  And of course, as good as nato is, we provide protection for the convoys that bring them new supplys. Grab a truck, put hose actual supplys in the back, drive them to the red cross camp, deliver, get the hell out of there, and in the meantime shoot some bad guys in there caves.

lets say you can load up a maximum

of 10 crates. If you are smart you devide them over multiple trucks. Cos if 1 gets blown up you still have some left.

the more crates you can deliver, the more karma you get at the civilians (and maybe at the new red cross/ldap faction so you get more convoy missions from

them)

 

 

last point. The medics.

 

I dont know how its like in the British Army since I never really worked with them. But in the regular dutch army its usually like this.

 

- Rifleman: Basic medical training. Putting on bandages, cat's, emergency transport, trying to get the guy breathing again (dont know the english word for it)

 

- Combat Life Saver: A rifleman with some more medical training. Usually 1 or 2 on a squad. Besides he basic stuff he is often also allowed to put in stuff like bloodbags.

I think this is just the medic in arma. His goal is to keep a person alive until an AMV or doctor comes in.

 

- AMV Algemeen Militair Verpleegkundige (in english? I think it just means military nurse). Most of the times located in a (field)hospital and is just like a normal nurse in a normal hospital. Working under a doctor and doing all kinda of advanced stuff.

But, they also go with convoy's or other missions. Its depending on what kind of mission it is, when you operate with more squads and all that stuff they have there own squad (usually a driver (private), a nurse (sergeant) and a corporal who helpes the nurse (i think he has cls training).

they have there own medical vehicle to treath wounded in the field.

 

and yes, if shits hit the fan, and wounded soldiers cant get back up there feet due to being injuired to much, and, when its critical, they need immeadiatly medevac.

 

so, when i look into this, i guess british army has something similair to this, its probably almost the same as we work right now on the server.

 

rifleman already have the basic bandage stuff and shit.

now you need another rifleman who can act as a conbat life saver. We have that, since that is the medic in a squad.

 

maybe you can add a medic squad with the nurse in it (AMV). The platoonleader can decide atthe beginningof a mission if they need he medic squad or not.

since its possibly to have different medic options if on the field or in a car. A squad medic (cls) can keep the wounded person alive till the medic vehicle comes driving in ( or you have to evac the guy to the vehicle), then simply handover the guy to the nurse, and turn back into action.

 

then its up to the nurse in the vehicle to treat the wounded person further.

if the wounded person needs surgery, that aint possibly in the vehicle, you then need a medevac to the base hospital.

 

 

Ok, maybe this is all too much for just the game, but it really adds more realism.

[Ryko]

@Borrel nice points I'll address them -

 

1. IEDs & Karma

 

I'll continue to investigate this, but the main issue is not a political / ethical one - it's a technical scripting one. If you kill a civilian, there is an easy way for the server to be alerted to this fact and reduce karma. But with disarming an IED there isn't an event handler that can really cover that so I'd need to use a bit of scripting that could degrade performance by constantly checking how many IEDs there are. For the potential gain, I'm not sure it's worth it, also given that as you rightly say, there's no guarantee that the villagers would actually be grateful that you had done that.

Karma is done on a town basis - essentially it's a general composite of how the town feels about you - to do it on a per-Civilian basis would probably also degrade performance.

 

2. Humanitarian aid

 

I'm not against this idea, in fact I quite like it, the question is just the right elements need to be in place for it to work properly. It can't just be a simple trigger or a player could figure out that if he picked up the same crate and brought it into an area then he could remove & replace the crate multiple times for the bonus (so now we're looking at a single one-time karma bonus, or a system that tracks how many crates are in the area). Where do the crates need to go for the bonus? Do you need to talk to someone and "advise" them that the crate is there - does there need to be a village elder? If so, now you've got to find this guy (and I've got to create a system for creating this guy).

 

And similarly to the IED question there's no guarantee that the crate would actually improve relations with the town - in real life they could be quite suspicious of foreign aid, and also be afraid of insurgent retaliation for colluding with the infidels.

 

What I'm actually aiming toward is a system where the civilian can tell you if they need or want something, and if you give it to them, it improves local karma (most likely it will be medical supplies, but it could also be weapons and ammunition, which could lead to a delightful situation of the civilian arming themselves with weapons given to them by the players should they decide to go insurgent).

 

3. Combat medics

 

What you're describing is kind of implemented like this right now.  All players can use bandages and morphine, combat medics can use IV's (blood, saline and plasma) and surgical kits, but those kits can only be used a vehicle.  If it's not working like that in practice, that's at least how it's supposed to work. For the squad you've mentioned there is Angel, which is available when there are 16 players on the server (or if the Plat Co activates the squad). The initial iteration of this system made it so that surgical kits could only be used in medical vehicles, but we found that a bit limiting and really slows down the action if you don't have a dedicated medical vehicle lying around.

[Borrel]

Thanks for the reply and reading it.

 

1. IED's 

If right now the problem is that it will probably be bad for server performance. Please don't add it. I think nobody wants less fps. Maybe, in the future there will be an event handler on IED's in future updates, if not, too bad then.

 

2. Humanitarian aid

I like the idea you have there. Asking a civilian what he needs. Would be nice if it can be implemented.

 

About the weapond and ammo. I dont think that will be very realistic. Yes, in real time countrys got weapond from others. Look at vietnam and afghanistan. Most of the times it was behind the scenes by countrys like russia and the usa (not going further with this sensitive political, but well known fact ?). But as far as I know, no riflesquad had ever given weapond to civilians. Yes, like the afghan national army and police was equiped with that kind of stuff but not civilians. We don't want to take part in arming civilians right? Most of the time we want to disarm them.

 

My opinion? Stick it with food, water, medical supplys.

 

3. Medics

Good point. I forgot about the angel squad. And yes, like I said, it is how it's done in reallife, but ingame you really don't want to wait long, get the action going.

 

 

But hey! This is just my opinion, and I am only playing on this server for 1 week. There are alot of others who are playing a long time here.

[Ryko]

1 hour ago, Borrel said:

My opinion? Stick it with food, water, medical supplys.

 

Except that as inventory items, only medical supplies are currently available

[Cellhawk]

Humanitarian Aid -

 

We should wait for upcoming Laws of War DLC and see how can it be effectively used in Gauntlet/Stiletto.

I'm quite eager to see the full content of the DLC, looks very promising in form of different approach to playing ArmA 3.

[BloodInTheSand]

53 minutes ago, Ryko said:

 

Except that as inventory items, only medical supplies are currently available

Bananas are food!

As for water, a civilian tanker typed vehicle could be used.