EU1 & EU2 NOTICE TO PILOTS RULES ARE CHANGING

[zissou]

Over the last while we have noticed a trend on the public servers of piloting getting steadily worse. One way pilots, constantly crashing pilots, pilots abandoning aircraft, pilots unable to land to list but a few of the issues.

 

These rules changes will not affect competent pilots.

Pilots are in charge of their aircraft they should make all efforts to keep the aircraft airworthy.

If aircraft are damaged they need to be fixed, not destroyed. If this means getting a repair specialist to travel to fix the aircraft so be it.  

Flying in a manner conducive to having you aircraft destroyed will result in discipline.

These rules will be enforced and pilots will be expected to abide by them.

The respawn time on Aircraft will be increased to encourage better flying.

 

They will be coming into effect on 01.04.16

Pilots seen to be breaking the rules will be asked to leave the pilots slot in which case they should return the aircraft to spawn and switch roles. If they refuse they will be kicked and if we see repeat offenders we will be forced to ban.

 

Examples of Poor Piloting:

1. Misuse of aircraft: CAS with the AA jet, practising, showboating and wasting resources.
2. Landing too close, or flying over, the AO. It shows the pilot is not aware of the situation around him and if it results in the lost of aircraft or team mates will considered destroying assets or teamkilling.
3. Abandoning aircraft in the field, this is all to prevalent and steps will be taken to weed out pilots who do this.
4. Making no effort to repair damaged aircraft.
5. Allowing your door gunners to teamkill. It's the pilot's responsibility to lock turrets. Teamkills will be attributed to the Pilots.
6. Pilots should make a reasonable attempt to land if damaged. For example engine failure or tail rotor loss are not unrecoverable. If you don't know what autorotation is you simply should not be flying a helicopter.
7. Not repairing aircraft in the field. If your aircraft is repairable then it must be repaired.

While these are not technically new rules they will be enforced much more actively, and it is the pilots responsibility to make sure you are able to fly within the rules.

 

For any possible scenarios not mentioned here or indeed any questions about the rule change please feel free to add a comment. 

[duffyman]

Great News 

[Anyone]

sounds like some really good changes to the rules,

[Mr.Missalot]

If aircraft are damaged they need to be fixed, not destroyed. If this means getting a repair specialist to travel to fix the aircraft so be it. 

 

 

What do the pilots do if the broken aircraft is far away from HQ, and there are no repair specialist's online?

Do they need to wait for some one to join repair specialist, or wait for some one to drive the bobcat/repair HEMTT to the aircraft?

 

I don't recall atm if there is a repair crate or something you can lift with another helo, but one would be pretty useful for when the aircraft you want to repair is far with no repair specialist online.

 

 

Great News 

 

Looks like this is it for your piloting career Duffy. (Joking of course)

[PiranhA]

What do the pilots do if the broken aircraft is far away from HQ, and there are no repair specialist's online?

Do they need to wait for some one to join repair specialist, or wait for some one to drive the bobcat/repair HEMTT to the aircraft?

 

I don't recall atm if there is a repair crate or something you can lift with another helo, but one would be pretty useful for when the aircraft you want to repair is far with no repair specialist online.

 

 

 

Looks like this is it for your piloting career Duffy. (Joking of course)

Was about to post almost the same, youve beaten me by a few seconds.

 

 

Yay, my 100th post on the forum

[zissou]

Yes we will be providing a repair and a refuel vehicle which will be liftable to help repair helis. Yes it's going be a massive pain but the thing we are trying to instil is a sense of value to the helis to avoid them getting damaged/destroyed/abandoned in the first place.

[ShortsNL]

Guys... if your aircraft is broken far from base... blow it up. as a pilot you should always carry charges.

 

That said, would it help maybe if people on TS get priority/can claim pilot slots?

[Gripe]

I'd suggest putting an airliftable repair truck and a fuel bladder into base so they can be airlifted to helos. Otherwise it will take too long.

[zissou]

Guys... if your aircraft is broken far from base... blow it up. as a pilot you should always carry charges.

 

NO, not anymore! No more blowing up your heli you've got to fix it!

[Extra]

Guys... if your aircraft is broken far from base... blow it up. as a pilot you should always carry charges.

 

If aircraft are damaged they need to be fixed, not destroyed. If this means getting a repair specialist to travel to fix the aircraft so be it. 

....

[Amentes]

While I'm not active on the Publics any more, I'd ask that you keep in mind that getting a Repair Specialist to actually do his job, isn't always that easy, if at all possible.

 

If the Pilots are getting worse, I can only assume that everyone else is too.

 

Judging from my experiences back when, that could easily mean that being unable to explosively destroy a grounded helicopter would necessitate a respawn.

 

It may well be necessary for the pilot in question to personally fly out that repair vehicle, if a lifter helicopter is even available for use.

 

It seems to me this would require serious enforcing on the part of Repair Specs too, as well as ensuring that fellow pilots lend a hand if a refuel is required, something I don't see specified in this change of rules?

[zissou]

I'd suggest putting an airliftable repair truck and a fuel bladder into base so they can be airlifted to helos. Otherwise it will take too long.

yup we will provide something for this

It may well be necessary for the pilot in question to personally fly out that repair vehicle, if a lifter helicopter is even available for use.

 

It seems to me this would require serious enforcing on the part of Repair Specs too, as well as ensuring that fellow pilots lend a hand if a refuel is required, something I don't see specified in this change of rules?

 

 

Yup it will need enforcing. But I can see pilots who ignore it getting banned and to stop trying, this is an attempt to change the server for the better and it will take time.

[Jason.]

Zissou I 100% understand where you're coming from here, and I largely agree with it.

But can you not see a scenario where a pilot will be waiting for a LONG time (potentially hours) for somebody to come and repair/refuel his heli but nobody comes?

Because I certainly can, I've played enough of EU1 to have experienced many situations just like it, so to force pilots to wait for another player to help them doesn't seem quite right.

If this is going to remain as a strict rule then pilots won't even try to land a damaged heli, because they know that then they will have to wait for somebody to repair/refuel them, instead they'll just crash so that they can respawn.

[zissou]

so to force pilots to wait for another player to help them doesn't seem quite right.

Nope they will have to get to spawn and bring the repair vehicle to their heli.

 

 

If this is going to remain as a strict rule then pilots won't even try to land a damaged heli, because they know that then they will have to wait for somebody to repair/refuel them, instead they'll just crash so that they can respawn.

Which is wasting assets and not allowed.

 

 

[Jason.]

Nope they will have to get to spawn and bring the repair vehicle to their heli.

 

So is it ok if the crash landed pilot respawns to bring the repair vehicle back to their heli?

[xSniper1982]

So is it ok if the crash landed pilot respawns to bring the repair vehicle back to their heli?

Yeah - this won't work...

The Heli will despawn before they can get back to it.

[PiranhA]

Just popped in my mind: what about the turrets being not locked? Possible to put a rule on that aswell?

[Tyberius]

So basically if a pilot crashlands a helicopter, he is forced to either wait for repairs/refuels which violates the "play your role"-rule or get repairs/refuels on his own which occupies another helicopter to lift them so he's wasting assets, breaking the "don't waste assets"-rule? (and yes, imho he is wasting them as one pilot will not have a helicopter available to him until the damaged one is fixed, the "lifter" is returned to base AND the shot pilot got back to his originally occupied chopper)

 

Also, on the account of guns having to be locked for most of the time (like seriously, do they have any use on a public server other than causing unneccesary teamkills?): could the Huron be replaced with its unarmed variant as the turret control script can bug out? (honestly i'd like to see all gatlings removed but sadly there is no unarmed Ghosthawk afaik)

[Amentes]

Yeah - this won't work...

The Heli will despawn before they can get back to it.

 

Not if it's crashed near the AO.

[ShortsNL]

The problem I see arising here is this:

 

 

1. noob pilot breaks/blows up own heli near AO.

2. noob pilot gets new helicopter, repeat step 1.

3. noob pilot doesn't bother repairing broken helicopters.

4. lots of people stuck at base because of no transport available, competent pilots suffering because noob pilots broke the helis

5. Shorts has to quit his current role and drive a repair truck over there himself just so people can get transport OR

5a. Shorts has to call an admin to kick the guy / help cleanup multiple crashed helis -> more admin support needed, admins have to quit their current game to help and Shorts feels bad for constantly calling an admin.

6. a lot of unhappy faces all around.

 

 

Don't get me wrong, the goal you are having is good, but I think this method will probably backfire. Also, when looking at the problem in general, we are not in a situation where it is currently impossible to get to the AO by heli in one piece. Usually the majority of pilots on knows what they are doing to a certain extent, and there is 1-2 noobs. This doesn't currently break the gameplay. If the goal is to get the level of pilots up to 5 competent ones at any time I don't think this is the right solution.

[zissou]

So is it ok if the crash landed pilot respawns to bring the repair vehicle back to their heli?

 

Ideally another pilot would take a repair vic to the downed heli.

Just popped in my mind: what about the turrets being not locked? Possible to put a rule on that aswell?

 

In the list check number 5 :-)

So basically if a pilot crashlands a helicopter, he is forced to either wait for repairs/refuels 

This is what we're trying to reduce the number of crash landings due to poor flying, a good pilot will choose a good lz away from possible danger so as not to have to crash land. 

 

These rules are going to affect the poor pilots who choose terrible landing sites where they can't land safely and end up crashing often. 

Yes everyone has a bad time now and again but if they make the effort it will not be the norm. 

We are looking at people to make a reasonable effort to repair. 

1. noob pilot breaks/blows up own heli near AO.

2. noob pilot gets new helicopter, repeat step 1.

3. noob pilot doesn't bother repairing broken helicopters.

4. lots of people stuck at base because of no transport available, competent pilots suffering because noob pilots broke the helis

5. Shorts has to quit his current role and drive a repair truck over there himself just so people can get transport OR

5a. Shorts has to call an admin to kick the guy / help cleanup multiple crashed helis -> more admin support needed, admins have to quit their current game to help and Shorts feels bad for constantly calling an admin.

6. a lot of unhappy faces all around.

 1. Noob pilot breaks heli because he was stupid and can't fly.

2. Noob pilot is asked to leave.

3. Noob pilot refuses 

4. Noob pilot is kicked

[TheScar]

Don't get me wrong, the goal you are having is good, but I think this method will probably backfire. Also, when looking at the problem in general, we are not in a situation where it is currently impossible to get to the AO by heli in one piece. Usually the majority of pilots on knows what they are doing to a certain extent, and there is 1-2 noobs. This doesn't currently break the gameplay. If the goal is to get the level of pilots up to 5 competent ones at any time I don't think this is the right solution.

 

pretty much this

 

Also,considering the workload to monitor this and keepin it up will take far more than this will achieve in the long run imo.

The repair your chopper rule is a nice idea,i proposed that on a regular base ... but i d limit this to base and 5k around.

 

And about the chopper  turrets,wouldnt it be easier to spawn them with "locked" guns by default?

init line ftw

Edited March 20, 2016 by TheScar

[zissou]

So we know this isn't going to solve everything we are trying to improve the situation. This way allows us to be more proactive in getting rid of questionable pilots. Yes there will be an adjustment period but with the help of regular players we know it can work. 

 

There will be times when there are no options but to destroy the heli and respawn but the longer respawn time on the helis will force people to try.

[razgriz33]

My opinion is this:

 

Is there a problem with stinky attitudes? I'll refer you to my other post 

 

Instead of adding rules, lets encourage a change of attitude. Culture is more important than law in both cases.

I would suggest an increase in respawn times for helicopters and look into the wreck recovery system that we saw off of domination from arma 2

[Gripe]

Is it possible to script it so the helos don't pretty much automatically lose fuel when they are damaged? The big problem is  that we would have to basically do two trips to get the downed helo back up, tying up either two helos for a fairly long time, or three helos for a shorter time. Coupled with this, if the original helo went down in a hot zone, we would be risking additional assets to get one back.

 

I believe it would be in keeping with real life tactics for pilots to blow up a helo thats in danger of falling into enemy hands?

 

I would maybe consider rewording some of the rules a little, right now it reads pretty harsh, and doesn't take into account that combat flying by definition is dangerous. Are we going to basically punish the good pilots who wait with their downed helo, possibly until the AO is done etc before repairs can get there? That could be 30 minutes or more. It will be boring, to put bluntly.